Young women today are encouraged to explore their sexuality as a form of empowerment. At the same time, we discourage them from seeking a committed relationship too early. This has produced a culture of no-strings sex and failed attempts to secure meaningful relationships, and many women are expressing their dissatisfaction with this script.
The first step in changing this dynamic is acknowledging sex differences. Embrace your femininity rather than your overt sexuality. Offer genuine emotional companionship. Lose the entitlement and shift your focus to giving.
Here are 25 things that men seek in a girlfriend. If you can cultivate and internalize these behaviors, you will be way out in front of the pack, because few women understand how important these qualities are to men.
Your results will only be as good as the effort you put into self-development, and will only be effective with a worthy man of good character. Don’t expect to flip a player with these moves.
Nurture: Escalate emotionally to create intimacy and loyalty.
Men are raised to be stoic, and they become adept at compartmentalizing their emotions. If you can bring out a man’s emotions, and create a safe relationship for him to express them, you’ve given him a gift, and he will repay you with loyalty and affection.
1. Actively support him.
Does he have an interview coming up? A big test? A rough week? Wish him luck, give him encouragement and let him know you are thinking of him. Express interest in hearing how things go, but do not create an obligation for him to report back.
2. Have his back.
In any kind of crisis, take his side. Always. Do not judge him. Whether he handled everything perfectly or needs to make some changes can be sorted out later if necessary.
3. Appreciate him.
Express thanks. Communicate the ways in which he makes your life better. Need him.
4. Physically care for him.
Feed him when he’s hungry. Nurse him when he’s sick. Hug him to show affection. Rub his back.
5. Have eyes for no one but him.
Actively discourage attention from other men. Avoid eye contact with other men. Ignore other men who stare at you or seek to engage you in conversation. Never, ever try to increase a guy’s interest by trying to make him jealous. Any success will be temporary, guaranteed.
6. Make him look good.
Be proud to be seen in his company, and tell him so. Work hard to engage his coworkers, friends or family in a friendly and generous way. Do not discuss his struggles or weak spots with anyone else. Create opportunities to introduce him to the important people in your life.
Cultivate: Bring effort and energy to the relationship.
7. Develop your own private language and inside jokes.
Whether it’s a nickname, a laugh shared, or a funny mishap, you can promote bonding by highlighting experiences unique to the two of you.
8. Be unconditionally generous.
Do nice things for him without keeping score. Focus on giving rather than taking.
9. Pay sometimes.
If he resists, as many men do, find ways to contribute financially other than splitting the check. Order tickets to a show. Cook him a meal at your place.
10. Remember his favorites.
Pay attention. He loves Maker’s Mark. He hates broccoli. He doesn’t eat pork. The Godfather is his favorite movie. His grandma’s lasagne is his all-time favorite comfort food. Find ways of bringing him pleasure by offering his favorite things.
11. Investigate his interests.
He’s a football fan and you know nothing about the game. Don’t pretend to be psyched for the Super Bowl, then stand around chatting and snacking with zero interest in the outcome.
He loves jazz, you think it’s for old people. Google the greats and then listen to some Miles Davis. Play it next time he comes over. He’ll be delighted you took the time to learn something for him.
Always respect the things he cares about. Never demean his hobbies.
Maintenance: How low can you go?
12. Be a pressure relief valve.
Be low maintenance. Be a safe haven, a person with whom he can be himself, even on his bad days.
If he has to work late, express understanding and flexibility. Don’t expect him to entertain you; offer to stay in sometimes or do something cheap and low key.
13. Do not compete with family and friends.
Appreciate his loyalty to family and friends, and his need to spend time without you in other relationships. Never compete for his affection with people who are important in his life.
14. Reduce your expectations.
Ditch The Rules. Don’t focus on minutiae like how long it took him to reply to your text. In fact, ditch the texting. It’s a terrible way to communicate anything but plans. Reward him for calling with a spontaneous plan on Friday night – say yes if you are free.
15. Avoid controlling and possessive behavior.
Never expect him to read your mind. If he asks what’s wrong and you say “Nothing,” it’s on you. Resolve conflict with a minimum of drama, and once resolved, let it go.
Never ask him to account for his time. Don’t ask him how he knows that girl at the bar.
16. Maintain privacy as a couple.
Let him know you’re not cackling with your hens about the relationship or his foibles.
17. Respect his privacy.
Never, ever go through his phone, email, facebook, etc. I have seen many women fall into this trap, and I once did the old-fashioned snoop for letters myself back in the day.
In addition to this being a form of theft, there is absolutely nothing to be gained by it. There is no upside to snooping. You can’t prove a negative, so you can never really be reassured when you don’t find incriminating evidence. You’re also likely to magnify any perceived infractions.
If you feel the need to stalk his media, it’s a symptom that something is not right in the relationship, and you should address that directly.
18. Suppress your neuroses.
Women are prone to crazy emotional drama, I admit it. It’s almost always best not to show this side of yourself to a man. Work out your emotional baggage with a therapist or close friend. You’ll be glad in two months that you never shared your paranoia that he had the hots for your sister or that you were sure he was dumping you that time his phone ran out of juice.
19. Stay sober.
Don’t be a sloppy drunk, it signals low value in every conceivable way. He might enjoy getting to see you tipsy now and then, but blackout drunk is never attractive.
20. Resolve conflict without emotional excess.
Express disappointment judiciously and without drama. Reward the behaviors you like, and withhold approval for behaviors you don’t like. Listen to his point of view. Never allow girlfriends to direct your actions or suggest confrontation.
Be his sex goddess.
21. Delay sex until you have achieved emotional intimacy.
He’s not going to commit to you for the sex, so you want to create a foundation for a relationship before you have sex. He should be thinking, “This girl is awesome, now if only the sex is great…”
22. Perform aural sex.
Tell him you want to be alone with him at a time when you have to wait. Tell him what you find sexy about him. Tell him you are so hot for him and only him. Talk dirty to him. Share a fantasy. A few whispered words can send an electric shock through a man’s body. Too many women neglect this form of seduction.
23. Jump his bones.
Surprise him, initiate physical contact. Men often say they want a girl who is a slut for them only. Let go of inhibitions and modesty. Be his sex goddess. Give him plenty of reinforcement when he turns you on.
24. Connect emotionally during and after sex.
Make eye contact. Be a bit vulnerable. Tell him your favorite physical things about him – his chin, his elegant hands, that small spot on his face where no whiskers grow, the soft area between his shoulder and chest that makes such a perfect pillow for your cheek.
Accept him “as is.”
25. Never go into a relationship with an idea of changing a man into what you really want.
These actions will help seal the deal with an emotionally available and mature man. Before you try for commitment with a man, you should qualify him as relationship material. Even one month of your time and effort spent on a player is a total waste.
For every bit of effort you make, he should be right there meeting you halfway. He should be:
- Interested.
- Reliable.
- Consistent.
- Moving the relationship forward.
You will need to be patient. It takes time to develop genuine intimacy and closeness. But you should see these four qualities at all times. If any of these are missing, he’s not a good match for you. Cut your losses and drive on.
{ 1351 comments… read them below or add one }
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Is this your indirect way of telling girls that they should learn how to cook?
It is disappointing that “lose the belly” is not only NOT the first thing on the (sub) list, but is not mentioned at all.
Yes, I understand that you do not like talking about it, and that is very likely stems from you not wanting your female readers to hate you (or inadvertently cause some eating disorder), but still. You can’t be his sex goddess if you are not sexually attractive.
But, Ramble, if they are together, then that must mean that he is already sexually attracted to her.
No, it doesn’t.
===========================
BTW, great list.
Good advice. For wives also.
Some minor quips:
If he is a football fan, it is OK if you are not. The fact that you respect his interest in the game is more than enough.
In fact, going tailgating *without* your girlfriend is a really nice experience. And if the boys come over to watch the game, and she keeps herself busy with her own interests, while bringing in food, drinks and snacks for his friends every now and then, well, that is really great.
And, guys, if your team does lose, that should not sour your attitude for the rest of the day. It is a god damn game*.
One big exception to this, IMO, is if a girl is not much of a drinker. She will have a glass or two, but, basically, almost never gets drunk, or even buzzed. If that girl gets drunk, well, that is adorable.
====================================
* Playoffs excepted. That hurts.
It’s a great list but it makes me want to cry given how few women I know who can even score 5/25 in their 40s.
@Ramble
This…remember the game store story I told a few threads back? That wasn’t about her being into gaming but respecting my interest in it and accepting that I shouldn’t have to wall my own interests 100% away when with her to just focus on her.
Great list.
Some thoughts in response.
1 and 2) “Actively support him. Have his back.” Great advice. Many men feel that they have to be these rocks of strength and never be affected by anything and that showing any weakness to a woman will cause her to lose attraction. Yes, men should become as emotionally strong as possible and improve on their abilities to deal with the world but on the other hand few men are really superman and it’s huge to know that you can let down the stoic front just a little and know you won’t get your balls chopped off.
3) “Appreciate him. Express thanks. Communicate the ways in which he makes your life better. Need him.” This is huge!!!! The opposite of this is the nag, the critic, nothing’s ever good enough. The nagging and the man feeling like he has to walk around on egg shells is a huge attraction killer. I personally respond very well to appreciation, thanks and knowing I’m needed. I think other men do to but would love to hear from the men if they feel the same way. It inspires me to want to do more and use my creativity and intimate knowledge of my woman to do special things for her and to just generally be there for her in ways big and small. I think a lot of women look at the 20% or whatever of men that are players and cads and how their appreciation to them never ends up in a relationship or a good one and then think they need to treat the other 80% or so of men that way. The opposite–and your advice–is the truth.
8 “Be unconditionally generous” This is great advice in light of many girls being too entitled and thinking they need to be aloof and maintain all the power. Choose wisely whom you act this way with–make sure he’s not an asshole–and this will reap rewards. However, don’t think that this will work with a man that just isn’t into you (95% of the time it won’t) and then conclude that all men are jerks and you shouldn’t be giving to any men.
11. “Investigate his interests.” I love football so being able to watch a game with a girl is great. She doesn’t have to love it but can enjoy it. Learn the rules. Find an angle about it that interests you. For example, if you like celebrity relationships find out who the football players are married to or dating. It might be an interesting conversation with him too. If she doesn’t know the rules then I’ll explain them and that helps her understand it and find it more interesting. Women should learn the bare basics of whatever he finds really interesting. The man can do so for some of her interests too.
15 and 18. Avoid controlling behavior and neuroses. Agree!!!!
“Be his sex goddess.” Totally agree. Most men come from the frame of mind of sex scarcity and having to be the one to pursue and sometimes get it grudgingly from the woman. Of course there are exceptions, like the woman is really into him in the limerance phase of the relationship. Overall, by instigating at times and always making it good and sincerely letting him know how much he turns you one he will really feel like he is sexy, something that many men are starved to feel. This is a simple market principle. Not much supply of making men feel sexy so he will really value it from you.
I would echo Ramble’s sentiment and suggest that these things are very important to most men once the woman has passed the hurdle of being physically attractive enough.
To be somewhat simplistic the first hurdle is looks (and each man will differ a bit) so do what you can to improve there. But, the meme that men ONLY care about looks for a relationship is definitely false. I can understand that you might be assuming in this post that the couple in question have been out a couple of times and that the man finds her physically attractive enough. If he does find her physically attractive enough then this list is where his focus will now be (and I’m not saying what that ‘enough’ is for each men and some men do need to be realistic too about how cute a woman they can get). The other caveat is that if the woman is on the borderline of cute enough then upping her cuteness will definitely help, some examples could be losing a few pounds, getting the right haircut, clothes, makeup, smiling more, etc.
Once the sufficiently attractive hurdle is passed then the man will start to care about the woman’s personality. However, since men know almost instantaneously if they find the woman to be attractive or not her personality and this list will come into play very quickly. If she seems too cold or bitchy, a qualified-in-her-eyes man may just not approach, especially somewhat shyer types, but the players will.
Once the looks and personality hurdles are crossed then I would say her achievements are the last thing. Women hate that this is true but it is. They’ve applied the logic that since they find a man who can achieve is attractive to them that it should be to men. Of course, most men don’t want an idiot, a total slacker or a bum but neither do most men need the woman to be so high achieving either. As long as she has a decent career and is doing something positive with her life that is enough. An exception might be to some extent with UMC professionals who want 2 high incomes but even there looks and a great personality and an average job like being a school teacher will trump average looks, average personality and great job 99.9% of the time.
“will only be effective with a worthy man of good character. Don’t expect to flip a player with these moves.”
But what’s wrong with seduction, a la Casanova? The way I view it is positive, as creating excitement and pleasure. And shouldn’t you, too, if you’re sex-positive and love-positive? Oh, that’s right…. it needs to occur in the context of something called a “relationship”, without a question. God forbid we actually think outside the politically correct box here
@Ramble
I’m happy to say it directly. Every young person should learn to cook. I find cooking with my husband a lot of fun, and we did that a bunch when we were dating. But a woman who cannot cook is missing out on one of the most nurturing things you can do for people you love.
I didn’t address any aspects of personal appearance in this post. This is about behaviors – the way a woman conducts herself in a relationship.
@Ramble
I like your quirky quibble quips.
@Han Solo
Thanks for all that great input!
Yes, that was my assumption, but you guys should feel free to ask for the world!
Great list, Susan.
I’ll add a few random thoughts…
1. Pre-season preparation is key. Before trying to get into an LTR, the woman should be:
A) Raising SMV as high as possible. Look at what men really like when it comes to spending $ on sexual entertainment, not necessary what they claim that they like when women ask them. It will have some provocative elements and other women may actually attempt to sabotage some of these things and tell you why you don’t need them.
B) Finding an outside emotional outlet/punching bag that she can regularly dump the emotionally toxic “bad stuff” on, thus freeing her to consistently bring her A-game to her LTR partner. It’s a bit like playing a team sport—your teammate deserves your best performance, other people just don’t. *
*this one may be very hard for chronically negative affect/neurotics, because they may seek vampire-type arrangements with more stable personalities and then really unload on them.
C) Finding some common guy interest/hobby areas that you actually do enjoy doing, that won’t require a sacrifice. Obviously the more of these you naturally have the easier it will be to find points of commonality, but the pre-season can be the time to experiment with different things and find the ones that you genuinely like.
You are creating the largest mutually beneficial,”win-win” negotiation zone possible for LTR activities, and most women just don’t do this for whatever reason. It’s a big potential advantage—IME, men will refer to a woman like this as a “cool chick”, which is actually a mark of considerable respect.
Example: “We went skeet-shooting the other day—it was Susan’s idea, she’s really into it. Afterward she wanted to go watch the UFC at a sports bar.”
Response from male chorus: “Wow, that’s a cool chick.”
This doesn’t work if it is just an unsustainable act designed to lure the guy in. It has to be genuine.
D) Finding a way to credibly signal that you are a very, very low divorce risk.
E) Finding a way to credibly signal that you will not allow an LTR to suffer deterioration in sexual frequency or quality. If the potential male really is a high-SMV alpha, then for God’s sake keep his penis unloaded by any means necessary. Don’t even think of hunting for dangerous big game animals unless you have the sex drive to match such wild appetites.
F) Accepting that men are eternal children and finding a way to credibly signal that the man you are with is the hottest, most asskicking alpha in the world as far as you are concerned, and praising these traits frequently. Even if he is a classic low-N, harmless beta provider, tell him that he’s a badass and make him feel dangerous. Routinely compare him favorably to predatory animals, superheroes, or even action toys like Optimus Prime.
@Jet Tibet
That’s a good point. Most of what I learned on this list, I learned in marriage. Especially the part about having his back no matter what. That deserves a post of its own.
Haha. Amusing framing! In other words be the opposite of typical Western fembots. Good luck with this Susan.
I understand why you are saying this, but, I don’t agree. There is a reason that, in almost every culture, young men (and I am specifically talking about young men) did not focus on that task.
There is actually a fair amount of effort and knowledge needed to be a competent cook. Things like, understand how certain things keep, and what does not. What is spoiling and what is, simply, delicious funky cheese. Understanding what cuts (of meat, poultry, fish) can be “stretched” and what can not. What foods are are more economical and which are not. How to diversify your families diet. How to plan meals for the week. How to “put up” fruit and veg. etc. etc.
I didn’t even mention any cooking techniques.
Now, assuming that you want to live in a society with lots of good engineers, doctors, scientists, surgeons, researchers, lab techs and fairly advanced technology, plumbers, carpenters, electricians and, in general, lots of good technology (and, understanding that most of thee jobs will be filled by men…men who needed to dedicate a fair amount of time learning these skills to begin with) then it is shortsighted to say, “Well, young men, you should be learning how to cook TOO”.
If they do, great. But, if the ignore that particular task to become an accomplished General Contractor, well, that is more than OK, in my book.
Now, if some girl does not know how to cook by the time she is pregnant, well, that is a little different.
Again, there is a reason why every successful culture in the history of the world organized itself this way.
(BTW, I love to cook…sshhh, don’t tell no one.)
@Susan
We ask but “gravity” soon brings us back to earth!
Routinely compare him favorably to predatory animals
I actually disagreed with your “C” entry, but, this was awesome.
quite.
@Bastiat Blogger
LMAO.
Why exactly are these things considered politically incorrect?
@ HanSolo
It isn’t us that “gravity” affects the most.
@Adam
If I had married a woman intelligent enough to guide me, to rule me without my feeling that I was ruled, I should have taken good care of my money, I should have had children, and I should not be, as now I am, alone in the world and possessing nothing.
Giacomo Casanova
You got me thinking about Casanova, and I was surprised by some facts about him. From Wikipedia:
“He mentions over 120 adventures with women and girls, with several veiled references to male lovers as well.”
Only 120? I would have guessed a much higher number.
“Alcohol and violence, for him, were not proper tools of seduction.”
“Casanova claims not to be predatory; however, his conquests did tend to be insecure or emotionally exposed women.”
“Casanova valued intelligence in a woman: “After all, a beautiful woman without a mind of her own leaves her lover with no resource after he had physically enjoyed her charms.”
@SW
Great post, Susan. Actually the last one was quite impressive as well, though I don’t njoy reading stats. You certainly did prove your points about who is having sex with whom though. I’m glad to see some common misconceptions laid to rest, though I doubt they’ll stay there.
I’m happy to say it directly. Every young person should learn to cook. I find cooking with my husband a lot of fun, and we did that a bunch when we were dating. But a woman who cannot cook is missing out on one of the most nurturing things you can do for people you love.
Completely cosigned.
I would add to your list, “Don’t obsess on past relationships.” If you are satisfied with your partner’s character, don’t worry about/be jealous over past partners.
I would also agree with Ramble that it’s not necessary to embrace all of each other’s interests, though I have no objection to people doing so. But it is important to maintain some separate space and interests, I think.
That’s an insane amount of wisdom in one post, Susan. All are excellent, #s 18 and 20 especially. If a woman follows those rules and also has the good fortune of being pretty, she might start a war a la Helen of Troy.
Ramble, I’m going to respectfully disagree about the cooking. Not everyone has to be a cordon bleu chef or even manage a family kitchen, but life is so much better if you have some basic cooking skills. And not knowing how to determine if food is spoiled is dangerous in my book.
Wow, Ms Walsh, that is an interesting quote by Casanova. Thanks for sharing.
Like Casanova, my ideal in seduction would be seduction of worthy (not stupid, for one thing) women and without the use of violence (obviously) or alcohol (well… socially, but not to coerce into having sex; that is so anti-seductive). As of right now, I cannot see seduction as necessarily predative, but perhaps my views will evolve
@BB
Great advice there about pre-season training! I agree that a woman should bring her A game in the first place – look her best, have interests of her own, etc. For example, it’s much easier to give a bf considerable freedom to hang with his friends if she has friends of her own she wants to see. If she has her own interests, time apart can be productive and enjoyable for both parties. And it gives him a chance to crave her company again.
Agreed. When I say “investigate his interests” I mean do the work necessary that you can share in it. You don’t have to love it, but the idea is to respect his interests and meet him halfway. If you don’t, you’re either going to attempt to hold him back from doing what he enjoys, or you’re going to be going along for the ride without any real interest. That may work in the early days, but the novelty wears off quickly.
I hadn’t been thinking in precisely those terms, but I do think these 25 items should go a long way toward accomplishing that.
This is where “I can’t get enough of you” comes in. Assuming it is genuine, a woman helps herself a lot by letting him know this as much as possible.
Interesting – how does one do this with a guy who is in fact not badass? Do all men really want to feel this way?
Exactly.
@Ramble
The reason I said that everyone should learn to cook is because of the average age at marriage. A guy who goes to college is not likely to marry before 30. That’s nine years after leaving school, and if he doesn’t live with his parents, he needs to prepare meals to eat healthily and economically.
I have enjoyed watching my son learn to cook – he and his gf often help me at the holidays now. It’s just a good life skill.
@Cooper
Because women are taught not to go looking for a man, trying to get an MRS degree, and not to serve a man’s needs. Almost everything on this list was either omitted or discouraged when I learned about relationships growing up.
Female narcissism has increased rapidly under feminism – there’s a prevalent attitude of “What’s in it for me? I want to be treated like a princess,” etc.
The irony is that a woman gets her own emotional needs met when she fulfills another person’s needs. That’s also true in friendship and parenting. We need to make it OK for women to dedicate themselves to pleasing their mates as a way of ultimately pleasing themselves. More giving, and less taking. And more assumption of personal risk – back to the idea that it’s the woman’s job to escalate emotionally.
Susan, thank you, this is information that a lot of girls don’t really get. I’m especially curious about the part where you bring your “A game” to your partner. At the risk of sounding stupid, are you supposed to not bitch to your partner about your problems? Are you supposed to try and seem happy always? Are you saying that there is a middle line between always being happy and being a terrible bitch? If so, how would this look like? What’s the correct amount of bitching?
Ramble, um, nowadays women want to become doctors/engineers and so on. If women can find time to have high powered jobs and raise children or carry pregnancies, then I think men should also learn how to cook. I think both sexes ought to be able to cook.
Susan, I love this list! It’s a great follow-up to the emotional escalation post.
I try to meet all of these points with my husband, which has helped make our marriage harmonious.
About the shared interests: so many young guys play video games nowadays that I think it’s worthwhile for girls to look into it.
That’s a great one! I can recall having difficulty with this hurdle myself. And it didn’t help when I met my husband’s ex while exiting the hardware store, no makeup, carrying a mop and bucket. Meanwhile, she of the “confused sexuality” was in tight jeans and a leather bomber jacket looking sleek.
@Bobley
Thanks! I believe you are new? If so, welcome!
@Adam
There is nothing wrong with your desire to rack up some STRs if that’s what you want. But I’m sure you’d agree that a woman seeking an LTR should not waste her considerable time, energy, and emotion deploying this plan with you.
Just a thought, that’s a funny way to put it — “correct amount of bitching.” I would say, go on the side of least possible amount of bitching.
Being 8 months pregnant comes with hormone-induced emotions and physical ailments. So I’ve been struggling with this a little. I find that it’s fine to complain every now and then, but don’t expect to be treated like a princess for any reason. It’s okay to reveal your unhappiness and vulnerabilities, but do try to get ahold of yourself and your emotions, discuss issues calmly, and not make it a drama fest.
Nobody likes a perpetual whiner/complainer, even if it is a friend, family member or significant other. Try to strive for happiness in whatever way you can, and don’t expect other people to solve your problems for you. This can be very difficult when you’re in physical or mental pain, but it’s where personal discipline comes in. You can’t be happy all the time, but you can try to meditate, take a walk, exercise, or do other things to get yourself back up to a balanced state.
Plus, if you only complain when something is really bothering you, and do it very rarely, you’re more likely to be taken seriously than if you “cry wolf” all the time.
J, I hope that you noticed that I did not mention one cooking technique. I am not talking about being able to make a great Swiss Meringue Buttercream.
The ability and skill to manage a household and nourish your family is extremely important. Hopefully, in the wake of financial crisis and our record setting fat asses, this is really evident.
re: some basic cooking skills – no argument. But that is not, IMO, what we are addressing.
And not knowing how to determine if food is spoiled is dangerous in my book. That’s right. And knowing that some fermented foods are OK to eat, like some cheeses, and others are not, like rancid meat, is important. And, assuming that we will continue to default to women as the source of nourishment in most families (and, we should), then it is important that they learn these skills.
I don’t disagree with this basic idea, but, I think things are much bigger than that. But, to make a long story short, think of it this way:
One of the ways that girl, back in the bad old days, could emotionally escalate was by preparing a nutritious and satisfying meal for a man that might be living in squalor (he is not poor, just a man with other priorities than keeping his place clean and peeling potatoes).
And, this was a very socially acceptable way for a girl to satisfy a man’s basic and primal needs and no one would call her a whore for doing so.
I can recall having difficulty with this hurdle myself. And it didn’t help when I met my husband’s ex while exiting the hardware store, no makeup, carrying a mop and bucket. Meanwhile, she of the “confused sexuality” was in tight jeans and a leather bomber jacket looking sleek.
Meh. It happens to the best of us. We have our good days and our bad. Besides, at this point in her life, she may be sporting a buzzcut and a football jersey. And, if not, you’re still the woman he chose.
OTOH, DH’s favorite joke is that he’s going to buy a boat one day and call it the Lori C. after an ex.
The first item on the list should be “Know that he is the gatekeeper to commitment and that he can rescind that commitment at any time and for any reason. It is your supremely rewarding pleasure to maintain his desire and motivation to keep that commitment.”
I am not talking about being able to make a great Swiss Meringue Buttercream.
Can you do that? Can you add chocolate? If so, I love you.
@Just a thought
I have learned through trial and error that works best is to let my husband vent whenever he needs to vent. When I do that and support him – it is always the other person’s fault – he feels the need to bitch less. I just listen and sympathize. Since I got good at this I find that he is equally generous with me. It’s really just as corny as the golden rule in action.
I would not pretend to be happy when you are not. I tend to be a cheerful, perky type and when I’m feeling blue my family finds it disconcerting. Too bad. I don’t inflict my mood on anyone – I may want some time alone, or just to listen rather than be a good conversationalist. I think it’s important to be genuine in a relationship, though cultivating a positive attitude is going to make you more attractive.
@Hope
I should have dedicated this post to Mike C. He felt the loss of the post with real examples of emo escalation, and said that he likes posts giving women advice on how to be more relationship worthy. I had him in mind when I wrote it.
I agree!
“John Seely Brown: I would rather hire a high-level World of Warcraft player than an MBA from Harvard.”
http://bigthink.com/ideas/45592
I totally agree, and I had great success cooking for men when I was single. I truly believe it put me in the “can’t live without you (for right now)” box with several guys.
Thank you, that really puts a spring in my step.
@Private Man
That is an excellent preface to the whole post, thank you.
Good advice.
@Susan and Private Man
How true is it that men really are the gatekeepers to commitment?
The general principle to be a gatekeeper seems to be that he or she who decides last (or less often or less readily) is the gatekeeper since the other has already decided she or he wants it.
With sex, especially casual sex, women are seen as the gatekeepers since on average men want it significantly more and with less discrimination regarding whom.
In light of this post (aka, that many young women need this advice) and that many women in there 20′s don’t want a relationship but would rather study, work or party. Plus with the many young women who will excessively blow out a guy for seeming too needy and clingy if he expresses that he’s looking for a relationship and not just casual (I’m not talking about the legitimacy of a guy waiting long enough to know her to like her beyond her looks). I would say these types are a minority but still a significant percentage that definitely affects the market. The other factor is hypergamy. If the 6 girl won’t even go out or hang out or whatever with the 6 guy who wants a relationship then effectively she is the gatekeeper and is preemptively keeping her relationship gate shut to him.
Now with the players and cads who are getting lots of attention then they are certainly gatekeepers for commitment because they either don’t want it at all or can be very selective in whom they commit to. In generically assigning men as the gatekeepers of commitment I wonder if there is not a bit of the apex-player-cad fallacy going on to some extent because we do hear about a lot of guys who do want a gf of their own MMV (especially the 6′s, maybe even 7′s, and below) but are having some difficulty in finding one. I won’t opine on how many such guys there are except that they probably are not a majority but are also not insignificant.
Even from evo-psych women are going to be careful and hence gatekeepers about whom the commit to.
So, what is meant by saying that men are the gatekeepers to commitment? Is it really the men that women want to commit to them and are thus of equal or higher MMV than her and would thus have other equal or better options than her? I can believe this but then really it is women who are the initial gatekeepers by filtering out most men and then it could be the remaining men that she is interested in are the later-stage gatekeepers.
Any thoughts on this to clarify it would be appreciated.
@47 My bad on the poor spelling and grammar. I will improve!
“then really it is women who are the initial gatekeepers by filtering out most men and then it could be the remaining men that she is interested in are the later-stage gatekeepers.”
This I do not understand either.
@47
I’ll amend my statement to also include alphas and highly-desirable alpha-betas and greater betas.
Now with the players, cads, alphas and greater betas who are getting lots of attention then they are certainly gatekeepers for commitment because they either don’t want it at all or can be very selective in whom they commit to. In generically assigning men as the gatekeepers of commitment I wonder if there is not a bit of the apex-player-cad-alpha-greater-beta fallacy going on to some extent because we do hear about a lot of guys who do want a gf of their own MMV
@Cooper
I would suggest that women might be the bigger commitment gatekeepers overall because they screen out such a high % of men as not worthy of her, what I called the initial gatekeeping phase.
My opinion, and curious about other’s, is that men who are 9-10 are cleaning up, either getting casual or having a good selection for LTR’s. (But you still have to choose wisely, Robert Pattinson!)
When a man’s an 8 he does pretty well in today’s market. It’s below that level where things increasingly fall off for men, especially as you get down to 5-
@Susan
Can you please help me understand the two immutable biological imperatives, that we’d talk about earlier. I still really do not understand.
Is our biology supposed to never be excused? Or are we supposed to avoid it?
Do women embrace hypergamy, or do they avoid it?
According to these biological imperatives, is a man right in seeking “access to sex with as few complications or commitments as possble?”
Does being a man mean I’m supposed to escalate with women I have no intensions, or foresight, of giving commitment to?
I made a massive forum post, but I believe it is too long and cluttered.
It seems like both biological imperative exist to serve each individual sex, while signaling long-term commitment risks towards the opposite.
How are we supposed to deal with these two? (ie are men right in avoiding a hypergamous women, and how should women feel about a ‘variety-seeking’ man?)
Is a monogamous relationship always suppose to be built on both sexes renouncing their imperatives?
@HanSolo
The answers all lie in the 80/20 rule. (I’ve been think about this myself)
If one is to assume that the distribution of men/women along the 1-10 attractive scale is proportionate to each other, (with slight exceptions to how women can dress up a few point, and guys can use game) then there obviously must be a disproportion to who’s sleeping with who.
This is perpetuated by both sexes. Women are want to sleep with high status men, and are potentially willing to risk participating in a harem to do so. While at the same time, guys are happily sleeping with multiple women, some of which below their SMP, whom they have no plans of ever giving commitment to.
I have absolutely no problem doing all these things for a man, provided he does the same for me. Reciprocity is key.
Wow, great list. Amazing how such a list would be “politically incorrect”.
While I might have minor quibbles here and there, this is pretty damn good list.
I would note that #25 is extremely important. The fact that it’s at the end should not be an indication of precedence. In fact, it’s the prerequisite.
What this list boils down to is being a woman of worth such that a man would be happy to commit to.
Can you do that?
Actually, Italian and Swiss Buttercreams are much easier than most realize.
@Cooper
I read your forum post and would say that many hypergamous women reward men who are following their male imperative (aka, players, but not dumpster diving) because it signals high value and capability. A hyp. woman needs to have her hypergamy reined in (via culture as it was in the past with assortive mating and strict norms, or enough heartbreaks or p&d’s to clue in, or her own common sense) in order to find a man that will find her attractive enough to commit. So, yes, she does have to rein in her natural imperative for getting the top genes and balance it out with her other natural imperative of having a protector against the wolves and a provider against hunger. However, today, in rich and safe societies there are few wolves and little hunger so that 2nd natural imperative isn’t signalling as strongly as it would have 500 years ago and so the hypergamous desires are the more dominant signal and have gradually expanded their hold on the female psyche (especially in the teens and 20′s).
For men, they have 2 imperatives too, the primary one is to spread seed but in the many-wolf, little-food world this is actually an utter failure because the woman and baby will be much more likely to die. I think this is why many men innately respond to being needed. It pushes those buttons that says he’s in a provider/protector-is-needed environment and he responds. Not saying this is the only factor but I believe men have somewhat of a range that their genes make them capable of and they will respond to the environment. Of course the genes themselves are spread across the spectrum of commitment-vs-spread-seed.
As to your point that men don’t want overly-hypergamous women I would see this as being more that the woman doesn’t want the man as opposed to the man not wanting her. The 8 man would like the 8 woman but if she’s hyp. then she won’t want him. Now, if she’s a slut or hyp. then that will be likely to make him less desirous to commit to her but the bigger factor is that she won’t want him.
Overall, I would say that for stable monogamous relationships that both sexes do need to rein in their imperatives you mentioned. There is an assymetry in that woman find men more attractive who are able to get other women while men are more objective because they base more of their attraction on easy-to-observe things like looks and even pleasant personality whereas women are attracted in part to more nebulous concepts in men like status relative to other men and relative to her.
Susan, that was an interesting article.
HanSolo and Cooper, good point about the initial gatekeeping/filtering.
Here’s what I think happens. Basically, men and women do initial filtering, then from those who make it through the filter, audition to see if there is a mutual match.
Men’s filters are mostly physical and so don’t take much time. Women’s filters are less physical and so they tend to take more time to get to the auditioning phase.
I believe Susan’s advice is geared toward this auditioning phase for the woman who has filtered in a man.
“I believe Susan’s advice is geared toward this auditioning phase for the woman who has filtered in a man.”
No, its for the exclusively committed relationship phase.
Blue Velvet, well, maybe both. For example 9, 19 and 21 are about the beginning stages.
@INTJ
Hi INTJ. Can you explain what you mean? I don’t remember if you’re a man or a woman so wasn’t sure if ‘us’ is referring to men or women. Thanks.
I was referring to the idea that although we–men–might like to be with a 10 woman that since we have to pursue and get shot down by the 10 that we soon come to find the range of women that like us and most men will accept this sooner or later and by reasonably happy with it. OTOH, those women who are hypergamous can get STR attention from higher SMV men and maintain loftier expectations for longer. Although in the end, reality eventually dawns on most women too.
Hope, Susan wrote, “This is about behaviors – the way a woman conducts herself in a relationship” and 21 specifies that.
If that girl gets drunk, well, that is adorable.
That explains my hubby reaction to me getting drunk with 3 ounces of wine. I was embarrased and he was gigling and hubby never giggles.
I wanted to mention that I think you and Susan are both right in different ways both genders should be able to do at least three meals (3 types of breakfasts, lunch and dinners) in order to be ready to save money and still eat healthy on any situation there is nothing worst than depending on restaurants or fast food 24/7. But I do agree that a woman should be able to impress with her cooking skills. Women might like it when a man cooks for her, but after a while it loses the impact while men always get impressed when they can have a meal as good as in the restaurant at home once in a while or be able to read about a recipe and ask his wife/girlfriend to do it for him. That surely gets you a lot of points, IMO.
“women today are encouraged to explore their sexuality”
By whom? Parents? Do men ever explore their sexuality or is their activity restricted to just plain old fashioned pre say 1999 fucking or whenever it was before all these cutesy euphemistic fumigators were invented for women ?
“as a form of empowerment”
Is there a twisted irony built into a system where women claim empowerment via mutual genital rubbing with men? Do men seek out empowerment via other peoples genitals or are they, ya know, just plain old fucking? Imagine foreigners who read about American women in this regard just shake their heads in dumbfounded amazement.
“Embrace your femininity rather than your overt sexuality.”
That seems like a step in the right direction but really, what the heck is this “embrace” thing? Is it a women wrapping her arms around herself while kissing a mirror? Is her sexuality defined solely by the willingness of men, who are no-challenge to acquire low hanging fruit, to always penetrate whenever she says “go?” Well then, she would be very wise indeed to exercise restraint for her own personal well being and self respect today and for her choice of good men willing to commit to her in the future.
Crabb, in “Men, Women, Enjoying the Difference” makes a number of points which would cause HUSers’ teeth to hurt.
One which he emphasizes, and which is addressed glancingly by other practitioners, is that a woman’s trust and appreciation actually builds a man. Makes him bolder, more assertive, more proactive, a better provider, citizen, better in bed.
Tearing him down, on the other hand, has the effects you’d imagine.
IOW, it’s largely up to the woman how the man is.
I don’t recall if Crabb explains the mechanism. Possibly just being aware on a subconscious level of trust and appreciation, or its opposite, provides the energy.
Dr. Laura says the same in a different way.
I don’t know much about the response to Crabb’s book, but some of the reax to Dr. Laura’s view amount to, “Nobody can tell me not to nag my husband and tear him down! How dare you!”
Ramble, keeping and preparing food is nowhere near as difficult as it used to be or still is in some underdeveloped areas of the world. You don’t need that amount of detailed knowledge you write about in our freezer and refrigerator society. Boiling rice and steaming vegetables is easy and not time consuming. Toss up a salad and you have complete meal that even a 9 year old can make, what to speak of a med student or engineer.
Ana, that is all fine and good. But, I am talking about much more than that. Basically, traditional home economics, nutrition (soak your grains, soak your oats, acidic things like pickles and relishes help digest foods, etc.), nourishment, etc.
But, yeah, when a girl cooks something special for you, it can be great.
Great post, perhaps the equal of all of your other posts combined. If women followed this simple advice it would solve most problems between the sexes.
Now how to get women to follow the advice?
Boiling rice and steaming vegetables is easy and not time consuming.
Blue Velvet, are you feeding your children (or would be children) excess starch by NOT rinsing the rice before hand?
What about grains like wheat? How much of the wheat you are serving them is sprouted and then prepared with a wild yeast?
The list goes on and on.
But that is not necessary nowadays
That must be why we have a record number of people with serious allergies, inabilities to tolerate gluten, thyroid problems, Vitamin D deficiencies, etc.
Blue Velvet, all of the points do indeed apply to a woman in a relationship, which I strive for as well. But to get the relationship in the first place, I had to demonstrate to the man I love that I would be capable of all of these points, and more importantly, willing! He didn’t know 100% that I would rub his back and neck frequently, but I did drop early hints, and he saw that I had “potential” to be a good girlfriend.
It goes back to the title of this post, “effective ways to make him your boyfriend.”
@Susan:
“11. Investigate his interests”
—But don’t ever be better or more knowledgable in his interest than he is. If you naturally are, pretend you’re not, if that helps. In high school I dated a guy who loved to draw. When people praised my paintings in his presence, he got very put off. I wasn’t old and wise enough to master the art of praising him to detract from myself. To be honest, his drawing skills didn’t make praise come easily, either. Perhaps women should also stick with men who are better at certain things than they are.
“19. Stay sober. Don’t be a sloppy drunk, it signals low value in every conceivable way. He might enjoy getting to see you tipsy now and then, but blackout drunk is never attractive.”
—I used to work with a guy who had the most adorable and gorgeous girlfriend. I never saw this lady without heels and a dress. But at the end of every colleagues’ party, she would be absolutely smashed. Her falling to the floor became the official party ender. I remember helping to carry her to the car once. At a wedding, she wound up hiding in the bushes. They eventually broke up.
Oh, and the advice is all excellent, by the way. Great advice regarding player avoidance, too. They can’t be swayed and are only trying to fool you if they tell you so. I imagine that one thing better than a pump and dump for a player is a pump and dump with a bonus home cooked meal.
Great post once again Susan! You’ve hit this one straight out of the park.
Out of all of the tips, the section I seem to have the hardest time doing well is emotionally escalating. I think I’m supportive, nurturing, and feminine towards the men I date, but I’ve had 4 different men tell me that I’m “not emotional enough”. They have all said the exact same thing. I’m not naive enough to assume that the problem is with the guys either. If 4 different men all say the same thing, the problem is with me.
The question is how can I foster a more emotionally expressive personality? I think that my Myer-Briggs personality profile plays a big part in this. My ENTP ways probably do come off as more “cold” or “masculine” to some men. What can I do to appear more feminine and warm, personality wise?
The crazy thing is that I’ve done almost everything on this list, but I guess there is something lacking in the transmission and translation. Is it possible that I still appear cold and emotionless, despite doing the things on this list?
This feels like an “Is this real life” moment.
Ramble, I’m a sprouter and major eater of living foods myself, and that is even less time consuming than cooking, unless you go the gourmet route with dehydrator and all that. But your main point was that men who are busy with education or work don’t have time for cooking. THEY DO. If they don’t, how do you suggest they eat when they are single, drive-thrus? Boiling rice and steaming veggies, even if not sprouted or fermented, is STILL healthier than eating out most of the time.
“But don’t ever be better or more knowledgable in his interest than he is. If you naturally are, pretend you’re not, if that helps. In high school I dated a guy who loved to draw. When people praised my paintings in his presence, he got very put off. I wasn’t old and wise enough to master the art of praising him to detract from myself. To be honest, his drawing skills didn’t make praise come easily, either. Perhaps women should also stick with men who are better at certain things than they are.”
If you have to pretend with somebody there is absolutely no future in a relationship.
Sassy, just find a guy who thinks emotional women are clingy and psycho. He’ll appreciate your cool demeanor.
Great list for wives (and, except for the sin of premarital sex, for girfriends). Also, much of this stuff is good for boyfriends/husbands too. But… one item is totally wrong:
24. Connect emotionally during and after sex
Uh, no. Sex is not an emotional event for men. Women characteristically and universally don’t get this, which is why they have sex with guys to make them fall in love. It DOES NOT WORK… men fall in love by a completely different pathway that need not involve physical contact at all, and conversely a sexual encounter does not create or deepen feelings that weren’t already there. The male brain simply doesn’t work like that.
Sex, for women, is love. Sex, for men, is food. So leave the emotional expressions out of sex. It’s not welcome. Even if he loves you enough to marry you… even if you’re married for many years and have a bunch of kids… leave the emotion out of sex.
Trying to connect emotionally during sex:
wife: oh… ah… oh…. ah……. i love you so much…. oh…. ah…..
husband: {thinking:} Of course, I love you too… but why talk about that now, can’t you see we’re having SEX ?!?!?!?!
After sex, it’s even worse:
wife: I love you so much.
husband: zzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
@van Rooinek
I would disagree with this, at least on a personal level. For me, the highest goal I have in sex is to have a deep, bonding experience where we transcend from merely fucking to having our souls intertwined. However, I think I am on the more romantic end of the spectrum and so I would be curious about what most men think about this.
The way you’re describing sex seems more like a man who is not in love with the woman (maybe he loves her in a companionate kind of way) and just wants to cum and fall asleep.
I think men have 2 compartments for sex. 1 is emotionless and just wants it to be pleasurable and to cum. 2 is for sex with deep emotion and passion that is pleasurable but much more as well.
In fact, I often tell women that the way to tell if the man is really in love with her is to see how he acts after he orgasms. Once that driving urge is released and all the bullshit that men can fake about how he likes a woman is no longer needed, see how he acts.
Again, I’m more romantic than most men so maybe the average man is more of just a cold fucker. But I think not. I think you’re describing men more on the other end of the spectrum from me and not the ones in the middle. But I could be wrong. Cheers.
@van Rooinek
I do agree though that women should not try to fuck a man into loving her. He’s going to basically already be feeling some amount of love or pre-love or he’s not. Sex WILL NOT make a man love you that doesn’t love you. For the borderline cases, good sex can tip it in your favor and bad sex can end it.
@Cooper, ” @Susan Can you please help me understand the two immutable biological imperatives, that we’d talk about earlier. I still really do not understand.
Is our biology supposed to never be excused? Or are we supposed to avoid it?
Do women embrace hypergamy, or do they avoid it?
According to these biological imperatives, is a man right in seeking “access to sex with as few complications or commitments as possble?”
Does being a man mean I’m supposed to escalate with women I have no intensions, or foresight, of giving commitment to?
It seems like both biological imperative exist to serve each individual sex, while signaling long-term commitment risks towards the opposite.
How are we supposed to deal with these two? (ie are men right in avoiding a hypergamous women, and how should women feel about a ‘variety-seeking’ man?)
Is a monogamous relationship always suppose to be built on both sexes renouncing their imperatives?”
Coop, there’s a period in youth when both sexes are given space to act out their biological imperatives. Its called “sowing oats” and is allotted for from late teens through early twenties. By mid twenties our culture expects us to reign ourselves in and settle down.
Ramble,
There is actually a fair amount of effort and knowledge needed to be a competent cook. Things like, understand how certain things keep, and what does not. What is spoiling and what is, simply, delicious funky cheese. Understanding what cuts (of meat, poultry, fish) can be “stretched” and what can not. What foods are are more economical and which are not. How to diversify your families diet. How to plan meals for the week. How to “put up” fruit and veg. etc. etc.
………………
Now, assuming that you want to live in a society with lots of good engineers, doctors, scientists, surgeons, researchers, lab techs and fairly advanced technology, plumbers, carpenters, electricians and, in general, lots of good technology (and, understanding that most of thee jobs will be filled by men…men who needed to dedicate a fair amount of time learning these skills to begin with) then it is shortsighted to say, “Well, young men, you should be learning how to cook TOO”.
If they do, great. But, if the ignore that particular task to become an accomplished General Contractor, well, that is more than OK, in my book.
Learning what it takes to become a competent cook doesn’t take a whole lot of brain power to the point of it keeping you from focusing on becoming a scientist, contractor, doctor, engineer, etc., etc. Not to mention that you would need to learn this stuff (or most of it) while you’re supporting yourself. As for meal plans and diversifying your family’s diet, I can see how these two things would be a little more complicated, but nowadays, many mothers work outside the home so they would have to do both.
One reason to be interested in his interests is to have something to talk about. Not the bonding, relationship, enhancing talk. Normal conversation. That can’t be done if one party has no clue what you’re talking about and so an important part of his life is closed off.
If he’s interested in it, he thinks it’s important–unless it’s just sports–and if it’s important, there’s something wrong–mildly–with somebody else who doesn’t think so.
You don’t need, for example, thinking back thirty years, to know the order of battle for the Red Army in East Germany. It does show some concern if you know/knew something because if things went south, it would be a Big Deal and somebody might call him to see if he remembers how to read a map; one of those with all the tanks and stuff on it. The idea interests him. Did me.
Or perhaps it’s Civil War reenactment.
Or coin collecting. That could mean money in, or out, and a rider on your insurance. Going “what for? Some old coins? Sheesh.” is not a good idea.
The other thing is people tend to bond with those sharing some of their interests…. If it’s not you, it will be somebody else. Could be innocent. But why take the chance?
Basically, traditional home economics, nutrition (soak your grains, soak your oats, acidic things like pickles and relishes help digest foods, etc.), nourishment, etc.
Who teaches those things here? I mean I know all that because I come from a traditional culture but in here is mostly “open jar, put together, cook, eat” So this traditional healthy cooking is kind of hard to find so where do women that want to learn this can find it?
“F) Accepting that men are eternal children and finding a way to credibly signal that the man you are with is the hottest, most asskicking alpha in the world as far as you are concerned, and praising these traits frequently. Even if he is a classic low-N, harmless beta provider, tell him that he’s a badass and make him feel dangerous. Routinely compare him favorably to predatory animals, superheroes, or even action toys like Optimus Prime.”
Hilarious!
Nice list.
In the spirit of feedback, I’ll say that 5, 12, and 16 are the ones where I’ve seen the most spectacular failures. By “spectacular” I mean the kind that would either A) create a new inside joke for the guy’s circle of friends, or B) make the mere mention of the girls’ name set off a powderkeg for years to come. To expand:
5) Have eyes for no one but him – jealousy is probably the most powerful emotion people have. We used to have a term, “crime of passion,” which was recognized in certain places like France as a mitigating factor in murder cases – catch your wife with another man, and you won’t be punished as harshly for killing him and/or her as for killing anyone else. While I don’t support that as a legal doctrine, is does very realistically illustrate just how much you can twist the knife in a guy’s heart with a wandering eye. Don’t screw this one up.
12) Be a pressure relief valve – Don’t take this to mean you can’t let him know about your problems. What it means is that you should not bother him with problems that don’t have a solution. If the solution is putting some jerk in his place, changing a tire, mediating a dispute, or just holding you while you cry for a few minutes, that’s fine. If you bring him a problem that has no solution, all it can possibly do is add to his stress. Your bestie had a fight with you? Ask him to hold you. Your bestie had the third fight this week? Stop bothering him with your personal crap. Easy, bright-line rule.
16) Maintain privacy as a couple – If you’re not his first girlfriend, he will assume that nothing is private between you. You cannot tell him you’re different, he won’t believe it. If your friends don’t know about things, he will assume they are good liars. His mind will only change slowly, over time, as he starts to trust that you’re keeping things confidential. This is an easy one to screw up, because he only needs to see evidence of indiscretion once to assume it happens all the time. This is important because this is the line between a guy who dates you for the sex and intimacy and a guy who actually sees a future with you. The first time he finds out that your bestie knows he is afraid of iguanas, you’re done. Unless he’s too beta to do anything but resign himself to it.
Well, I did study for those nice useful skills and I learned to be a pretty good cook, too. It’s meditative. But now I don’t really benefit from dating a girl who can cook, it’s just a bonus. By way of example: a few months back, a nice girl invited me to her house and made breakfast for dinner. She made everything with instant mix. I was very pleased, and I told her so… but just going through the motions only gets a person so far. I didn’t have the heart to tell her that the next time she did that, it wasn’t impressive. It’s easy to look forward to “My girlfriend’s secret roast recipe.” It’s hard to look forward to “My girlfriend’s Bisquick.” Anticipation is part of the bond.
@ Anacoana
If you have a friend in the restaurant business, that’s one way to learn. I was fortunate enough to have two parents and a grandmother to learn from, but most of my skills come from my undergrad roommate. The man had been a sushi chef and an Irish pub griller for a few years before I met him. He showed me some tricks, mostly involving seasoning and timing. That’s the real skill: learning to make two or three dishes at once. Getting the timing down for an appetizer, a main course, and a desert all at once takes practice, but it never fails to impress.
Good post and solid list. Any woman who follows these 25 concepts, and is at least somewhat physically attractive will be in good shape to get the relationship she wants.
Every young person should learn to cook.
I understand why you are saying this, but, I don’t agree. There is a reason that, in almost every culture, young men (and I am specifically talking about young men) did not focus on that task.
There is actually a fair amount of effort and knowledge needed to be a competent cook.
Ramble,
I think there are different proficiency levels for things. Can I “cook”? Well, I can fry a hamburger, I can make scrambled eggs and an omelette, I can make pancakes. But if I went into a kitchen with Escoffier, I’d look like a complete moron. I think when it comes to skill sets, people have to decide if they want to be a mile wide and an inch deep, or a few inches wide and a mile deep. My personal preference is to have 2-3 things where I excel greater than 99.9% of the rest of the population, and then be just functional in alot of other things over being a jack of all trades master of none.
So. Yeah. I think a man should learn how to cook but just the very basics at minimum if he has no interest in preparing complex multiple course meals.
We need to make it OK for women to dedicate themselves to pleasing their mates as a way of ultimately pleasing themselves. More giving, and less taking. And more assumption of personal risk – back to the idea that it’s the woman’s job to escalate emotionally.
Susan,
In the spirit of agreement
, I can enthusiastically cosign this! 
Whilst I agree with almost all of the posts, I’m going to go against the grain here and disagree with numbers 14 & 15.
14 – “Lower your expectations”: this could be a little dangerous, especially if a girl’s expectation is to be treated with respect at all times. There are some expectations that need to be maintained for everyone’s sake.
15 – “Never ask him to account for his time, and don’t ask him how he knows that girl at the bar” – while this would work in a mutually respectful, loving and positive relationship, if the relationship is not so positive, a girl should have the courage to make an empirical inquiry based on facts. Also, being honest often trumps emotional repression.
I agree with the general philosophy that girls/women need to lose the entitlement attitude. However it has been demonstrated through famous social psychological experiments (e.g. Stanford Prison experiment) that once people, even good natured people, feel as if they have power over another, they can and will often abuse it.
Being nurturing, whilst expecting respectful treatment at all times, is arguably a better approach than just being nurturing unconditionally.
>> “But, Ramble, if they are together, then that must mean that he is already sexually attracted to her.
No, it doesn’t.”
Wait, WHAT?!
I mean, I could understand this if she’s “let herself go” since the beginning of the relationship, but do guys regularly get into relationships with girls who they aren’t sexually attracted to?
About the shared interests: so many young guys play video games nowadays that I think it’s worthwhile for girls to look into it.
Yup. As Bastiat said, this is the kind of thing that can get a woman automatically into the “cool chick” category.
Re: Cooking
I feel like this always gets overemphasized. The few times I’ve tried to cook for guys (the present bf included), they were kind of indifferent to it. Maybe they’re just weird. :S
This is a great post though! I’d love to see more “Girl Game” stuff.
“We need to make it OK for women to dedicate themselves to pleasing their mates as a way of ultimately pleasing themselves. More giving, and less taking. And more assumption of personal risk – back to the idea that it’s the woman’s job to escalate emotionally.”
More assumption of personal risk than him? Why? Escalating emotionally means sitting him down to have “the talk” and inquire about “where is this relationship headed”? That can scare guys off. Do you mean being the first to say the dreaded 3 words “I love you”?
The give and take should be mutual.
“Never ask him to account for his time”
Why not?
This list of 25 is actually two different lists merged into one. One is a list of things aptly titled “ways to make him your boyfriend” and the other is after he already is your boyfriend and you are in a committed relationship. While I would not ask a guy I’m casually dating to account for his time, I would ask my boyfriend to and DEFINITELY my husband. Also, I would not be “unconditionally generous” or unconditionally anything with a man who has not committed to me. What has he done to deserve unconditional treatment?
I should have dedicated this post to Mike C. He felt the loss of the post with real examples of emo escalation, and said that he likes posts giving women advice on how to be more relationship worthy. I had him in mind when I wrote it.
Susan, if you were a guy, I’d have to say you could run some tight game I’m sure
You got some good push-pull going 
Seriously though, again, very good post, and I have someone I am going to pass this along to who I think could be genuinely helped by incorporating some of the items here.
I can see feminists generally being appalled by this list, but all of the things on this list can almost always apply to men, too, in some way or other.
what you’re doing is telling people to be decent, interested, focused and not frivolous or narcississtic.
Alas, the players and feminists of the world tend to be, at beat, bean-counters when it comes to relationships or complete narcissists.
The most important thing about this list: It illustrates that you’re a man’s partner.
I would add–
Only, and ONLY, do this for a man who is interested in being YOUR partner.
Getting the timing down for an appetizer, a main course, and a desert all at once takes practice, but it never fails to impress.
Yeah but I was thinking more of recommending a book or a TV program food network should have this things shouldn’t it?
Escalating emotionally means sitting him down to have “the talk” and inquire about “where is this relationship headed”? That can scare guys off. Do you mean being the first to say the dreaded 3 words “I love you”?
Escalating emotionally isn’t about having “the talk” or asking “where is this relationship headed”. Escalating emotionally isn’t about displaying genuine warmth, interest in him as a human being, and forging a connection. If you do that, then having “the talk” won’t even be something that scares him off.
While I would not ask a guy I’m casually dating to account for his time, I would ask my boyfriend to and DEFINITELY my husband.
Not sure exactly what you mean by this, but if my fiancee popped off with a “what were you doing on day A at time X” in an inquisitive tone, I’d be like WTF.
“5) Have eyes for no one but him – jealousy is probably the most powerful emotion people have. …you can twist the knife in a guy’s heart with a wandering eye. Don’t screw this one up.”
This is another one that goes on the committed relationship/marriage list. Casual dating by nature means you will be sizing other people up for potential dates too.
Plain Jane alert
Seriously Plain Jane what the fuck do you win with this sick game?
I mean this is gold advice for women that want to find a mate and be happy do you hate women so much that you want them being unhappy for the sake of what? Some pride in yelling “I’m empowered, I never did anything to make a man happy so I’m better than women that do!”
Those words won’t keep you warm at night, they won’t grow old with you and they won’t cry with you when you have a problem, they won’t give you children to cherish and love. If marrying your pride would made women happy they wouldn’t be a need for this advice.
Or are you a lonely woman that can only gather attention and human interaction by harassing a blog? You know the best cure for loneliness? Find other people, and don’t be a jerk to them, they might stick around if you are, you know, pleasant at least occasionally. Heck you can find other harpies even and talk about how better than other women all of you are and leave us alone.
If a gal does all these things, she will not only make the man her boyfriend; she’ll make him her husband! I’d marry a woman like this-IF I could find her, that is. Ah, but modern women would rather DIE than even think about doing something nice for their man…
I’ll find a woman like this at the same time I find a unicorn in real life-ha!
“there’s a period in youth when both sexes are given space to act out their biological imperatives. Its called “sowing oats” and is allotted for from late teens through early twenties. By mid twenties our culture expects us to reign ourselves in and settle down.”
Given space by whom? Allotted by whom? Accepted by whom following this so-called “period”? Reigning yourself in does not get you a free pass with men. That is NOT how they feel about it. The angst among CERTAIN women regarding this is palpable.
“Sowing” is an effort; it requires work. The recipient and beneficiary of all the seed who made no effort has no reason to expect acceptance for not exercising restraint while easily and repeatedly laying around.
sow1 [soh] verb, sowed, sown or sowed, sow·ing.
verb (used with object)
1. to scatter (seed) over land, earth, etc., for growth; plant.
2. to plant seed for: to sow a crop.
3. to scatter seed over (land, earth, etc.) for the purpose of growth.
4. to implant, introduce, or promulgate; seek to propagate or extend; disseminate: to sow distrust or dissension.
5. to strew or sprinkle with anything.
Then ONLY men sow their oats. Women have nothing to sow and no reason to. Why do ONLY North American and some European women suggest otherwise? Women from nearly everywhere else would belly flop laugh at such notions.
Reigning yourself in does not get you a free pass with men. That is NOT how they feel about it.
_____
Well half of them anyway…..
@HanSolo
You raise a good question about who holds the cards re commitment. Essentially, men are the gatekeepers, but they may be offering a product with declining demand. While I don’t believe that is the case, it is clear that the timeline has shifted, and women are entering the commitment market later. It also depends a great deal on whom men are offering commitment to. The market breaks down into two niches:
1. Women who party. They are not interested in commitment from men who study or work hard, they’re interested in commitment from men who party. This is where much of the hooking up occurs.
2. Men who party. They don’t offer commitment other than in a “fake boyfriend” sort of way.
3. Women who study and work hard. They are less interested in socializing during college overall, as they tend to be very achievement-oriented. Many of these women do not pursue men in college, either casually or for relationships. Others would love a relationship, but get little attention from guys.
4. Men who study and word hard. May be willing to offer commitment, but find few takers. When they look around campus, they are more likely to “see” the party girls, who they accurately perceive are giving it up for asshats. They generally don’t connect with more studious girls.
The opportunity for more relationships lies with groups 3 and 4.
I believe that female hypergamy plays a role in hooking up – we know that men in college view beauty as being only a lightswitch away. Still, given the stats it’s obvious that there are lots of virgins, and lots of students who have an occasional hookup. If the Greeks, athletes and partiers are the ones having the bulk of the sex, then the question is “Are they disproportionately filling the ranks of the 8-10s?” If they are, then a 5 of either sex is unlikely to succeed unless they target a 5 of the opposite sex. On the other hand, if women in the 5-7 range are aggressively pursuing casual sex, then both male 5-7s and female 8-10s are displaced, which is what I have previously argued.
Oh, Susan – Amazing, beautiful, extremely helpful post! Will commit this one to memory. Aside from the sex stuff, I feel like most of these things could make up the formula for success in any relationship. Great insight and wisdom – thank you
@Abbot
I’m prepared to believe 50% of men don’t care about her ‘N’ being high, as long as they’re just looking for a quickie. I’m sure that they tighten standards when considering anything serious.
Tom is over excited (as usual) because of that crap question in the older survey. Crap because it did not specify what level of relationship was being considered when the level of N was considered.
If you ask a 18y.o. spunk monkey how much he cares about her N when he’s looking a quick shag…are you really surprised when he says he doesn’t care?
Ask the same question of a 35y.o. looking for a potential wife…you won’t get the same answer (in the real world)
in Tom’s world you’ll get the same tired old drivel about ‘cave man thinking’. He sounds like a superannuated hippy mmmmkay?
Crap surveys use crap questions to give crap answers
@Cooper
In my view, biology explains our drives, our impulses, and our base desires. Those of us who are ruled by biology alone are really no more evolved than our paleo ancestors. Civilization depends on human beings having the capacity to rise above their biology. We shouldn’t avoid it or use it as an excuse, but we should conquer it.
Some people, both women and men, lack either the wish or the capacity to suppress base impulses in service of some greater goal or purpose. Others are better able to delay gratification, weigh costs and benefits, avoid unnecessary risk and maintain a future time orientation. I think around half of this is genetic, and the other half is environmental or cultural.
Research clearly shows that some people are wired for short-term mating. They generally mate with one another and fail at attempted relationships. Clearly, a man or woman who is LTR oriented and chooses someone like this is in for a pile of heartache. I’d say women do this more than men do, hoping to change the guy, e.g. Christian Grey, but men do it too, or at least they are attracted to women in this group.
Yes. Both sexes compromise to arrive at the best possible outcome. Evolution has taken care of part of this – women have in fact evolved to prefer less variety-seeking men for long-term mating. Those guys may want their shot at short-term mating and be disappointed, or they may be frustrated that women are delaying long-term mating in general. The SMP is definitely wacked. But virtually all happily married people have found that compromise rewarding, and do not feel they have “settled.”
“women in the 5-7 range are aggressively pursuing casual sex, then both male 5-7s and female 8-10s are displaced, which is what I have previously argued”
and does coincide with slut-class confirmation from Joel-
“the majority of the average and below average women from the Western world are definitively, massively more sexual active than most of the men in their league”
Since the majority of women and men are average, what happens when these plain Jims FINALLY encounter these plain Janes recently fallen from their artificially constructed lofty perches couched as luvy wuvy “expressing” and “exploring” and “empowering” and all, hmmmm?
But your main point was that men who are busy with education or work don’t have time for cooking.
No, that was not my main point. My main point is that advising all young people that they “learn to cook” is nowhere near ideal for a healthy society.
Simply learning how to make baked cutlets is not enough to nourish a family. And nourishing a family will continue to be “women’s work”. Or, it will be the work of your local mega-mart, which is not a good strategy.
So, we need to start instilling in girls that to properly nourish their children (and husbands) there is a fair amount that they need to learn. And that they should know the bulk of it before they have their first child which is likely to happen before they are, say, 26-27 (Well, not likely, but that is a whole other discussion that also involves having healthy children) .
Learning what it takes to become a competent cook doesn’t take a whole lot of brain power to the point of it keeping you from focusing on becoming a scientist, contractor, doctor, engineer, etc., etc.
I am starting to regret that I chose the word “cook”. I should have said, “nourish a family”.
@Susan
cool list and mostly positive discussion, HUS is on form today
“Tom is over excited (as usual) because of that crap question in the older survey. Crap because it did not specify what level of relationship was being considered when the level of N was considered.”
Note, there is no longer any mention of women being denigrated by men for fucking around. Because, well, they are not denigrated. There is no longer any mention of women having restriction on their promiscuity. Because, well, it is abundantly obvious there are none. There is no longer any mention of a man’s willingness to fuck women no matter their pasts. Because, well, its a fact they don’t care. Now, therefore, the entire focus is on men – not women – and their willingness, however begrudgingly, to discard their natural tendencies and commit their entire lives to sluts. Why this focus? Because as the slut-class grows, as more women pound their youths away in the harem, there is a very real problem waiting for them upon exit: the lack of men willing to accommodate their fuck-to-family-transition fantasy. This entire “matter” is about the men or lack thereof. There is no other topic or issue to point to anymore.
Who teaches those things here?
No one.
.
.
.
Well, you can still find a few people who know the old stuff, but they are a dying breed. However, there is a growing interest in the subject, but they make up a fairly small minority.
@Abbot
if it weren’t for the fact that my taxes are used to subsidise single parents and the related costs to society (lauranorder,drunk kids on the streets) I’d be a highly interested on looker when this society plays out. ‘Where are all the good men?’ looks like the response to the first generation hitting the buffers (or wall). Enjoy the decline, ‘cos it’s not in our abilities to stop it.
@ENY
Yes, it is very important. I put it there to drive home the point that you can only succeed if you’re working with the right raw material. I caution that up front, and I want to emphasize that again at the end.
In addition to the female “preseason training” there must also be aggressive filtering up front. Women have no business taking on “projects” for rehabilitation – I think the failure rate is about 100%.
In short, “Yes”.
Some really basic factors:
1. Girls, and guys, are fatter than ever (along with the other things that come along with higher-carb, higher-sugar diets like bad skin)
2. Men, like anyone else, get lonely.
But, ask yourself this, those guys (regardless of their weight) you see with heavier girls: what kind of posters did they have on their walls in high school?
I understand that every guy is not going to end up with a bikini model. No big deal. But it does suggest that guys, in general, have the same sexual attraction cues as anyone else.
But, if the guy is lonely and horny, he can re-prioritize/rationalize to deal with it.
Emily, for what it’s worth, I don’t actually disagree with you.
I don’t think it is a big deal to your average 25 year old guy. But, the discussion got started because I was reacting to, “Feed him when he’s hungry. “
The advice is definitely for the auditioning phase, but it assumes a high level of interest on the woman’s part based on what she’s seen so far. She has qualified the guy as LTR material, and she wants to behave in such a way while dating that he is more likely to commit. IOW, the focus is on her auditioning for a relationship.
Yes, it’s the same principle as telling someone to always dress for work as well as their boss does. You always try out for the job by demonstrating that you can do it.
What I meant by embrace was to accept your natural feminine traits, and your desire to please a man and even be dominated by him, rather than feel ashamed of your female nature and compensate by acting more male.
Susan, re: party/non-party subcultures in college. I’m seeing this weird offshoot of the “study hard”, ambitious female demographic that embraces a limited, extreme-hypergamy offshoot of hook-up culture (they probably will not touch a guy below SMV-8). I don’t know what to call these girls, but “alpha females” seems to be the most accurate description. They use everything—brains, boobs, whatever—to outcompete others.
If there is a common denominator, it is that they seem to be the ones who have the most vitriolic distaste for the idea of ever relying on a man for economic or emotional support (for various reasons—not necessary because they hate men. Some just seem to detest “domesticated” women), and so they have been driven since at least high school towards wild over-achievement in various activity categories (one of the most sexually voracious that I know of is currently abroad as a Rhodes Scholar).
Coops, re: biological imperatives. We’re seeing a positive-affect movement emerging from evo psych that is concerned with what really makes people happy. There is a so-called “emotional command system” in the brain that contains neural circuits which are associated with various emotional experiences and displays—if you were to electrically stimulate, say, the RAGE circuit in rat’s brain then that rat would actually display violent anger. I think that an understanding of these circuits—allowing for individual variations in sensitivity, of course—could lead to a more psychologically satisfying existence, as one could be more precise in crafting the right “brain nourishment environment” around oneself.
For instance, I feel that I’m not specifically wired for either STRs or LTRs per se, but I have dopamine-mediated psychological requirements that would generally not be satisfied by a conventional LTR. As a result, my past romantic history looks like a volatile landscape of churning, high-N accumulation casual periods punctuated by LTRs that tend to begin and end with some inevitable and perhaps unfortunate “plate-spinning” at the boundary transitions between the two mating regimes.
I realize that if I am to feel satisfied, to not have buyer’s remorse-type regrets, to not become dangerous to myself/others, I personally need an LTR structure that somehow maintains the emotional and sexual dynamics of courtship. I guess one could say that this makes me an “asshat” by some HUS definitions, but I’ve made peace with this because asshats like me are the ones that Uncle Sam gets to jump out of airplanes or dive under ships at night, and HNW clients seeking alternative investment exposure can get to trade futures accounts for them and count on to make money when others are being destroyed.
Much of my romantic efforts are now directed towards figuring out how to build an LTR with repeated pulses of STR dopamine kick. Others may not have the same needs.
If you haven’t had a chance, you might take the online Helen Fisher “mating types” quiz and see where you fall within her little matrix. It’s an imprecise, quasi-scientific tool, but I think it can have great explanatory power that MBTI may occasionally obfuscate.
@Jonathan
I’m trying….
I do have one case study, a young woman who I have told all of this to over the years. She is succeeding because she has truly internalized a new attitude and approach to relationships. Also, the guy is a really, really good guy. He’s not perfect, but he’s an attractive man of good character.
She is really into him, and she wants to win his heart.
This is an example of the 80% getting together, btw.
Ouch! That does add insult to injury.
Anacaona August 10, 2012 at 3:27 am: “Plain Jane alert”
PVW: Where did “Plain Jane” post?
@van Rooinek
From Helen Fisher:
Helen Fisher: Everybody’s always wondered what happens in the brain when you’ve fallen in love, and we all know actually how you feel when you fall in love. But actually, what happens in the brain is, a tiny little factory near the base of the brain called the ventral tegmental area become active, and in some particular cells, called the A10 cells, they begin to make dopamine. Dopamine is a natural stimulant. And from the ventral tegmental area it’s sent too many brain regions, particularly the reward system; the brain system for wanting, for craving, for seeking, for addiction, for motivation and in this case, the motivation to win life’s greatest prize, which is a good mating partner.
Question: Can casual sex trigger love?
Helen Fisher: I think that all three of these brain systems can interact with one another, particularly when you have sex with somebody. Any kind of sexual stimulation of the genitals triggers the dopamine system in the brain and can push you over that threshold into falling in love with that person. And in fact, with orgasm, there’s a real flood of oxytocin and vasopressin, other chemicals in the brain associated with the feeling of deep attachment. So, casual sex is really never casual unless you’re so drunk you can’t remember it; something happens. As a matter of fact, in one study of over a thousand people, over 50% of both men and women reported that their first kiss of somebody was sort of the kiss of death. They had begun quite attracted to a person sexually and romantically and then when they kissed them, it was so horrible for them that it turned them off completely. So, casual sex is just plain old not casual. Something can happen. You can either fall madly in love with this person, or you can begin a deep sense of attachment to them.
http://bigthink.com/ideas/18575
I recall one time early in my relationship with my husband. We had just had sex, and I got a bit teary. Alarmed, he asked me what was wrong. I said, “Nothing, I’m just happy.” His response was amazing – a surge of affection and immediate re-arousal in record time. I think I trace his falling in love with me to that precise moment.
@Eoin
Great feedback there, thank you! One clarification: When I suggest that the woman should be a pressure relief valve, I mean that she should actively work to reduce his stress, not her own. What usually happens though, is that if she is a good and supportive listener, and doesn’t gripe about his needing to vent sometimes, he will generally return the favor. My husband and I do this for each other, but you’re right – it only works because we don’t need to do it very often. Also, it goes in waves. If he is having a rough patch at work, there may be weeks of debriefing during dinner where I’m doing all the listening. If I’m up against it, he’ll patiently be there for me. As you say, this should be reserved for important stuff, not complaining about how rude the supermarket cashier was.
That’s a swing and a miss for sure. I actually love the breakfast for dinner idea, though I would probably go for homemade corned beef hash or at least a nice frittata. It sounds like you’re a foodie, and you need to date a foodie.
We need Escoffier to weigh in on this discussion.
Van Rooinek “Trying to connect emotionally during sex:
wife: oh… ah… oh…. ah……. i love you so much…. oh…. ah…..
husband: {thinking:} Of course, I love you too… but why talk about that now, can’t you see we’re having SEX ?!?!?!?!
After sex, it’s even worse:
wife: I love you so much.
husband: zzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz”
Er, no, that’s not necessarily how it is .
Sheesh van, after I have had multiple orgasms with my man, the last thing I wanna do is chat..
I just want to feel my man’s body against mine and drift off into a wonderful realxing sleep.
Mind you, after twenty minutes he’s up for another round..
And.. I am happy to oblige.
@Claire
I cosign this.
And this.
The post presumes that the woman has qualified the male as worthy of an LTR. Putting this kind of effort into a guy who doesn’t like you or appears to avoid relationships is masochism!
@Mike C
You really got me thinking when you talked about what kind of posts you’d like to see more of. You were right – Girl Game, or something like it should be my bread and butter.
On the other hand, it’s vitally important that I get the market analysis right. For example, Girl Game posts make no sense if few women want relationships…
@Gorb
Definitely. That is why I listed the things women should be seeing from men every step of the way. In the past I’ve gotten some pushback from guys re consistency, because they feel (not incorrectly) that some push-pull is often required. I think a man can hold back a bit to create or cement attraction, but it’s very high risk for women to try and discern whether guys are assholes, or just “pretend assholes” trying to win them over.
Haha, she used instant mix for everything, and he was pleased, but that makes him a “foodie”. I love it.
Agreed. Any kind of suspicious talk is a real drag for guys – I hear this all the time. Usually, it’s not justified. I do think that light stalking on Facebook, the increasing tendency for women to go through men’s phones, etc. is a serious problem. Often the questions and suspicions come out of that.
I know one case where the woman managed to watch her bf like a hawk to ascertain what he typed for all his passwords. Soon she was regularly checking his phone and private Facebook messages. This was in the first six months of their relationship. She found some exchanges between him and an ex. He was definitely flirting, but his ex was the one initiating. This made my young friend crazy, but she had no way to ask him about it without confessing she’d invaded his privacy. She became obsessive about checking his phone every time he left it unattended. She learned that he’d seen his ex on a trip home, but there was no reference to hooking up.
It’s now been two years, and they are planning to move in together. She wants to marry him, and to her knowledge he has never cheated on her and he seems content in the relationship. Clearly, she made a big production out of nothing, or next to nothing. To this day, she still occasionally checks his messages just to reassure herself. It’s a prison of her own making.
There is no upside to snooping.
@The other Hope
I’m glad you like the post, and I knew that several of my female readers would omit the Sex Goddess part. That’s OK, it just gives you fewer steps to follow!
@Just1X
Thanks, it’s a nice way to go into a weekend
Aside from the sex stuff, I feel like most of these things could make up the formula for success in any relationship.
@ A New Hope
Why do you think the sex stuff would not work? Or, why do you not want to employ it?
@Susan
Fantastic list. I’ve been feeling guilty lately about breaking up with my ex, not because it was the wrong thing to do, but just because I still feel shitty about hurting her like that. This list just piled on a ton to that guilt, because she checked probably 22-23 of these boxes. The big issue for me was that she never really checked no. 11. That for me is huge, given how many interests I have. It makes me feel even worse that right before we broke up she started to show a bit more interest in my interests. However, I think at that point it was too little, too late.
The only other comment I would have is that for no 21, to be able to do that you have to kill it on the first 20. A guy with options will not stick around for a girl who’s got 8-12 of those first 20 in the hopes of getting to 21. She’s got to really nail 15+ of those to make him wait for 21.
@BB
I’m curious, are these women in sororities? I know that at some elite schools, top sororities can boast very high GPAs. It seems difficult to imagine that many people can pull off partying hard while maintaining high grades, though. For example, frats usually don’t include many engineering majors – those guys just don’t have time for play.
Do you mean an open relationship, or do you seek to get the dopamine kick with the LTR partner? If it’s the latter, I have definitely read about that – in fact, it may be Helen Fisher who discussed doing dopamine-related activities together. Perhaps this is why Explorers are best together.
It sounded like he was pleased the first time because of her effort, but none too pleased when she sought to repeat the experience. Having said that, Bisquick pancakes are pretty good.
@Zach
The truth is, a girl can do all 25 of these things, and it could still not work out. The timing may be off, the pheromones/bio match might be wrong, whatever. The “fall in love” switch doesn’t always get tripped, no matter how wonderful you are. There are no guarantees.
Re #21, I’m talking weeks – 4-6 dates, something like that. That should be enough time for both parties to have an idea about where the relationship is headed, or at least their interest in discovering that together.
Susan, I don’t think they party very frequently. The hook-up thing seems to be a kind of escape, an occasional indulgence. It’s appearing like they just don’t have time for LTRs—they are constantly looking at LSAT/GMAT stuff and planning grad schools and careers. On the other hand, they enjoy sex, probably are high T, and so on.
The stated life blueprint is almost always “following my year of backpacking through Asia and doing the obligatory semester in Florence, I’ll go on to complete my JD/PhD and then get that job with the Swiss biotech company, then buy my BMW, then I’ll find a husband. But I won’t settle; he needs to check off the boxes on this list.”
AFAIK, these women tend to want a lot of the same things in their mates, so competition for the few males who even have the basic, obvious qualities can become fierce. Now place this intrasexual competition for scarce resources within a group of arguably the most ferociously competitive young women in history, consider how these scarce males would learn to respond to the attention, and we get one aspect of hook-up culture.
Re: LTR/dopamine. I actually was thinking about a monogamous LTR with the STR dopamine chasers, rather than an open relationship. I agree with you 100% and think that Fisher is absolutely right about Exp-Exp couplings. I believe Explorers are particularly apt to make associations and then to have reflexive approach/withdrawal emotions that are triggered by these associations, so it can be imperative that the LTR partner be associated with fun, playmate-type activities, and that the more tedious, everyday routine stuff of life be separated from the romantic relationship with some kind of firewall (in contrast to “helpmate”-seeking Builders, who might love sharing those everyday domestic chores).
It sounded like he was pleased the first time because of her effort, but none too pleased when she sought to repeat the experience.
I completely understood. However, I would like to think that would NOT make him a foodie.
Now, if he demanded that his Mole Negro be finished with just the right Mexican Chocolate (assuming that the Almonds that were toasted in lard were unskinned, of course), now, that would be something.
I have only known a few of these people and they are not human. They are textbook memorizing, credential accruing, checklist-feeding automatons.
Walsh,
I’m impressed. This is exactly what “game”for girls looks like. The irony of course is that your advice is viewed as regressive but is actually way more empowering for girls than the current feminist “wisdom” that my penis definitely prefers.
Susan, that’s a very important point. There are no guarantees in love.
You can have all the right stuff, batting ~20 or even ~50 pointers, and still not get the guy because he’s just not in love with you. You just weren’t the “Right One.” Often it’s because of some unconscious biological and/or psychological factor.
Also, most people only truly fall in love a handful of times, and if you catch someone at a bad time, for example they are still in love with someone else and emotionally unavailable, then it’s not going to happen.
Plus, can you imagine someone like Zach or Bastiat Blogger falling in love with a shy, soft-voiced, sweet and nurturing girl who doesn’t ever party and is a homebody? No way, Jose.
Very good list Susan.
Only thing I can personally nit pick at is “avoid controlling and obsessive behavior”. Not saying I want a bunny boiler, but a just a tiny tiny bit of crazy in this area turns me on. For me, it shows a level of investment that can’t be matched in most other ways. This is no good if I’m not as into her as she is into me, but otherwise it’s kind of endearing.
Also, most people only truly fall in love a handful of times, and if you catch someone at a bad time, for example they are still in love with someone else and emotionally unavailable, then it’s not going to happen
Hope you are projecting a female pysche onto men. A woman can actually steal men away using the above list.
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